Re: question about proper Geographical designations
John W. Kitz <John.Kitz-gen@...>
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Pam, and others,
Looking for (historical) places in Europe?
This http://gov.genealogy.net/search/index database of place names, with links to pages such as this http://wiki-de.genealogy.net/GOV:DESSAUJO61CU one, has served me well.
Best of luck with your genealogical endeavors, regards, Jk.
From: John W. Kitz [mailto:John.Kitz-gen@...]
Sent: Saturday, 01 August, 2020 19:58
Subject: RE: [German-genealogy-ENG] question about proper Geographical designations
I probably should add that I found the way in which German places are organized quite complicated. E.g. typically today a place would belong to a district, a district to a state and finally a state to the country named Germany. But probably owing to historic reasons to date I've come across numerous exceptions, such as so-called district-free places, being places that administratively belong directly to a state rather than to a district, which in turn belongs to a state.
An example of such a place would be the (in German) Kreisfreien (or district-free) City of Dessau in the (in German) Bundesland Saches-Anhalt (State of Saxony-Anhalt).
In addition at this time it is my understanding that other exceptions exist as well, such as Place, Municipality, District, State, Country or Place, <district-free> Municipality, State, Country, etc.
Some examples from my data:
· Germany (Place, District, State, Country): Mainbernheim, Kitzingen, Bayern, Germany;
· Germany (<district-free> Place, State, Country): Dessau, Sachsen-Anhalt, Germany;
· Netherlands (Place, Province, Country): Amsterdam, Noord-Holland, Netherlands;
· Hungary (Place, County, Region, Country: Debreczen, Hajdú-Bihar, Észak-Alföld, Hungary.
I hope this helps a bit more.
From: John W. Kitz [mailto:John.Kitz-gen@...]
According to this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prussia article Prussia (German: Preußen) existed from 1525-1947.
According to this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prussia#The_end_of_Prussia passage Prussia officially ceased to exist on February 25th, 1947.
For the history of Germany you might refer to this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germany#History passage.
For what it's worth I have so far entered all my German places using their respective German names followed by the name of the so-called Landkreis in German, then the Bundesland (equivalent of a US State) in German and finally Germany in English as the country. But that's just my personal preference at this time. Fortunately the genealogy software I'm using is pretty flexible, so I can change things as and when I consider that necessary. I opted to write all the names of the countries in English to make it easier to converse and exchange data with other, whereas I opted to write all place designations (such as province, county, district, state and what have you) in the local language, i.e. Dutch, English, French, German, unless that would render the place designation illegible for me.
I hope this helps, somewhat.
Enjoy what's left of your weekend, regards, Jk.
From: main@German-genealogy-ENG.groups.io [mailto:main@German-genealogy-ENG.groups.io] On Behalf Of Pam Gosling
Hello, I have a multi part question regarding “proper” designation of earlier Germany/Prussian areas:
If I’m writing for example a birth location for a date between 1871-1932, should I write “Prussia” or “Germany”, or does it really matter?
If I’m noting a specific town, e.g. “Neuenberg, Soldin, Landsberg/Warthe, Brandenburg” do I need to list all four location designations, or should I only list some of them?
Should I put “both” Brandenburg and Prussia in a listing, or is Brandenburg sufficient since “Prussia” included other areas besides Brandenburg?
Am I correct in assuming that the same rule would apply for “Pommerania”, or “Saxony” if those were the locations in question?
Regarding Saxony/Thuringia, is it more appropriate to use “Thuringia” instead of Saxony, if the event in question occurred after the date of change of designation of territory? In other words, should the designation always match the appropriate date of the event? Or is it necessary to be this particular?
Is there a general rule about whether to use the “original” German names, or current Polish names, for those areas of Eastern Germany that are not part of Poland. I have put the current Polish as a side note in my tree so far, and left the German name as the primary location in the address bar.
I only ask for the purposes of sending appropriate tree information to native Germans, to avoid offense or to cause confusion among non-Germans, because they might not understand the differences in geographical locations.
Thanks so much for any help! I so appreciate this opportunity to participate in this group!
Sincerely, Pam in California